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Don Tago
12/29/2003 11:56:42 PM

Psychology of a UFO Believer: The Downfall of Rational Thinking

What makes an normal run of the mill individual believe that funny little green men are visiting us here on earth, rooting thru our trash, mutilating our cows, and trampling our crops? I will go thru the different types of people that protest they are having these alien encounters, and the types of people who believe them, and attempt to try and explain the processes behind them accepting the outrageous claims they recount time and time again.

One of my favourite replys i get to my comments on here is something along the lines of "my father taught me not to argue with an idiot, because you might not be able to tell the difference between them." thats classic. Thats is the best line of defense most people have against scientific evidence about the possibilities of aliens visiting us here on earth. Instead of commenting on anything i had said, they simply just dismiss everything that i said, taking it all as heresy against their beliefs. This is not an uncommon reaction to science. Think about Copernicus, Galileo, Darwin and many others who tried to deconstruct peoples romanticised views about the universe and explain them mathematically and scientifically. So i do not blame you all for your reactions, they are totally predictable and very understandable.

So to begin, what would persuade a person to believe that aliens have visited our blue planet. One of the first things that comes to my mind are people who use these sorts of beliefs as replacement for religious beliefs. Nobody wants to feel like we live in an empty void, on a lonely rock far from contact with any other life. They want to think there is something more. These are very similar reasons why people put their convictions in religion, to fill a void. Its very comforting to believe we are being watched over, and that we are interesting and fortunate enough to be studied. They believe that these aliens will bring their enlightening intelligence to us, and bring a new Golden Age in humanity, without war or violence. Most people find it hard to accept the cold hard facts that we are on our own, we are not altogether interesting, and that when we blink out of existence, the universe will not falter or notice. We are simply an accident that is here, that will exist and will soon disappear all in a blink of an eye in the span of our universe. These first group of people i have been describing are the "seekers." Ones who look to the stars for the answers, instead of a Bible.

Next there are the "dissolutionists." People who have felt betrayed by the world, by politics, by people, by the government. They can be defined as the people who watch X-Files, and take it as gospel, people who live in their parents basements when they are 35 watching Star Trek, people who when you walk into their house and turn on their TV, you find that the Sci Fi channel comes on, they are the conspiracy theorist who think aliens built the pryamids, and sunk the Titanic. They are at a constant odds with the reality of the world. They see the govenment as an evil that is trying to hide the truth from us and is only looking out for their own self interests. (Isnt it convienient that the goverment is covering everything up, which is always the disolutionists explanation of why there is never any physical evidence.) They think that there are alien space crafts being held at places like area 51 and places of the like, where they are being examined and studied for their tactical uses. They learn this thru their TV shows, their movies, and their literature. As you see, life imitates art, or another way to put it, they are trying to claim that art is being manifested in life. Isnt it hilarious how UFOs and aliens have evolved exactly in their percieved reality as how they were represented in those aweful B movies of the 40's and 50's. Do you know how many alien sightings there were before the 20th century, before all this alien hysteria started. Virtually NONE. All of a sudden, these movies and tv shows start about the phenomenon, and what do you know, people start seeing those things in the sky. What a coincidence.

Then there are the people who claim to have witnessed the landing of a alien spacecraft, who communicated with the creatures, who had medical experimentation conducted on them, who take pictures of them running around in their backyards, who go out and make crop circles. They are the "deceivists." They are most likely normal everyday individuals who think they can make a name for themselves convincing everyone of their outrageous claims. They are the ones who fuel the beliefs of the dissolutionists and seekers. They are the ones who are actually being a detriment to society.

Additionally, simply because a person has worked for the government, or has a PHD or is an rocket-scientist, doesnt make his or her claim about aliens visiting our planet any more reputable than anyone elses. Ive been shown quotes by certain people who are reputed as being "high ranking" or "offical" as claiming certain things about aliens, and say "so what!" People will always try and tell you what you wanna hear, and when people are being told what they want to hear, they will listen, unwaveringly!

One reason people are so taken in by these alien encounter stories and sightings is that they dont understand our universe. To completely understand the potential for aliens to visit us, you have to understand physics, astronomy, evolution, and so many other fields. But the bulk of the population does not understand these things, so they are more than willing to accept whatever they are told. Since most people dont understand the universe, then individuals can attatch whatever irrational properties to it they need to make their beliefs compatible with what they see. For example, if i want to believe my girlfriend loves me, i will believe whatever non-true things i have to in order to make myself continue believing it, all the while ignoring the plain fact that she does not love me.

Alien spaceship sightings are merely a product of our society and popular culture. People see what they want to see. Ever walked up to a person you could have sworn was someone you know, and it turns out you were completely wrong? In a criminal investigation, physical evidence takes precedence over eyewitness accounts, because eyewitness accounts can be divergent and unreliable. People dont know what they see, people can convince themselves they are seeing just about anything. If people have preconcieved notions of what they think they are seeing, or of what they WANT to see, then what they say they see can not be reliable. If you go out and night and LOOK for alien spaceships, your gonna eventually see something that looks like it could be an alien spaceship.

Nowadays, its impossible for anyone to look unbiasedly at the night sky, when we all are bombarded with XFiles, Sightings, Taken, Close Encounters of the 3rd Kind, Independence Day....Aliens sell, they sell BIGTIME!. And it is in corporate americas best interest to KEEP us believeing in alien visitation. Then they can pump out movies like Signs, Predator, Mars Attacks, and so on. And i admit, its a fun prospect to believe that there are aliens out there. But however fun, its not a reasonable belief.

People are always telling me, "How can you say all this, you should be more open minded." Well, I am open minded. But when i make myself familiar with the reality of things, i dont keep my mind open to perposterous notions. I dont keep my mind still open to the possibility that the earth might be flat, or that the Sun orbits our planet. Science plainly proves these things. So there is no need to keep my mind open to them.

I hope you enjoyed reading this as much as i enjoyed writing it, if you have any questions or comments over than you would like to post on this message board, email me at recebedou@yahoo.com ...thanks!


 replies will be listed below this message edit


  Replies 1 - 10 (out of 44 total)

Bill
12/30/2003 2:28:35 AM

funny, this person is so convinced that ufo's and aliens don't exist...atleast not here on earth and he is so sure that everyone who believes in them or claims to have seen them are wrong, period, and then has the audacity to go and insult them....think about that for a moment...how does he know for sure? are we the only life in our universe? how could anyone think that? you'd have to be an idiot knowing what we know about the universe....why can't he admit that it is possible? why does he think he knows for sure? could it be because of his religion? he did make a reference to the bible...well, if there is a god, why couldn't he have made others in the universe? its ironic by him stating that they don't exist beyond any doubt and ridiculing others he ends up in my opinion ridiculing himself by showing his ignorance....whether you believe they exist or not the FACT is that it IS possible that they do exist whether he wants to admit it or not. And I might as well mention that I have indeed seen a ufo up close...not 50 yards overhead moving by silently at about 20 mph, it was silver with overlapping panels and possibly rivets in them...it was about 40 yards long...25 yards wide, front to back....its edges were rounded off...it had a bright white headlight in front and a blinking red light on the bottom middle of one wing and a blinking green one on the other wing. it was absolutely amazing. of course alot of you won't believe me, but i swear to you on my mother's grave i'm telling you the truth. cheers.

Bill
12/30/2003 2:38:30 AM

funny, this person is so convinced that ufo's and aliens don't exist...atleast not here on earth and he is so sure that everyone who believes in them or claims to have seen them are wrong, period, and then has the audacity to go and insult them....think about that for a moment...how does he know for sure? are we the only life in our universe? how could anyone think that? you'd have to be an idiot knowing what we know about the universe....why can't he admit that it is possible? why does he think he knows for sure? could it be because of his religion? he did make a reference to the bible...well, if there is a god, why couldn't he have made others in the universe? its ironic by him stating that they don't exist beyond any doubt and ridiculing others he ends up in my opinion ridiculing himself by showing his ignorance....whether you believe they exist or not the FACT is that it IS possible that they do exist whether he wants to admit it or not. And I might as well mention that I have indeed seen a ufo up close...not 50 yards overhead moving by silently at about 20 mph, it was silver with overlapping panels and possibly rivets in them...it was about 40 yards long...25 yards wide, front to back....its edges were rounded off...it had a bright white headlight in front and a blinking red light on the bottom middle of one wing and a blinking green one on the other wing. it was absolutely amazing. of course alot of you won't believe me, but i swear to you on my mother's grave i'm telling you the truth. cheers.

liz
12/30/2003 4:04:58 AM

How very generous of you, Don, not to blame all of us "believers" for our reactions. In the same spirit of generosity, I won't blame you for your diarrhoeal verbosity.

Don Tago
12/30/2003 12:00:10 PM

This just keeps getting better and better....I wish if someone was going to reply to my post, that they would do it in an intelligent fashion, and not simply blurt out how close minded they thought i was, and then regale me with some ridiculous story of their own close encounter... I think that there is a good chance that aliens COULD have come to visit us by now, but if that possibility could be measured, it would be microscopic, and ESPECIALLY not to the level that it has been reported, if you read all my past posts, you will see how very apparent this is. You people are entitled to believe whatever you want. But until you take into consideration the science of it all, you are just as crazy as those Heaven's Gate people, people who see Elvis, or people who think the earth is still flat. Your beliefs in alien spacecraft visiting earth are simply faith driven, with no scientific evidence behind it. So dont talk to me like i am crazy, when i have science on my side. And just cause you say you see something doesnt mean anything. Thousands of people claim to see the body of Jesus revealed to them, or the Virgin Mary manifested in a bran muffin. Now just cause all these people say they see these things, should we simply take them on their word. The fact that so many people are seeing these alien spaceships simply shows how desperate everyone is to want to see something that isnt there.

Bill
12/30/2003 1:10:25 PM

dude, your wrong. i have no way of proving it to you, but i know that your wrong. i have seen them with my own eyes. you will continue to believe that they don't exist, but i do think your assesment of the odds of ufo's being here on earth being "microscopic" is a bit irrational. i get the feeling that you think mankind has aquired alot of technology and that we are super sophisticated beings. well that is true compared to anything that you know exists as far as life goes. but it is relative. yes we are numero uno on this planet. but consider for a moment, open your mind a little, use rational thought and think about this...mankind just started flying 100 years ago ok....now, take another intelligent life form and assume that they started flying 500 thousand years ago....thats not that hard to believe correct? i mean somewhere in the universe ok. now think about it for a moment. use your noggen. doesn't it make sense that we could not even comprehend what they are like or capable of. in fact, if anything, you might come to the conclusion that they can and have mastered space travel. just because our infinitely small understanding of science and our universe dictates that we can't comprehend traversing the emense distance involved, doesn't make it impossible. you just assume that it is highly unlikely based on your understanding of what we currently know which is squat in my opinion...sure its alot compared to what we have known in the past, but it is all relative, if you can't admit that then you are ignorant in that way, actually we are all ignorant in some ways, obviously....alot of people in history have always thought they were very intelligent and advanced with the same pomposity and self righteousness that you have displayed in regards to science and religion....such as the world being flat, the world being the center of the universe, etc....its only logical....think about it....only 500 years ago, people couldn't comprehend what is going on today in science, etc. now im asking you to comprehend what is possible for a life form 500K years more advanced than we are....you can't do it....i can't do it......i just happen to know they exist, that's about it.....before i thought they probably did based on the evidence out there, but i wouldn't have been surprised if they didn't exist.....you on the other hand take the position that they don't exist here on earth....a microscopic possibility you say.....you ignore the evidence which is pretty ignorant in itself, but then to assume you know what is possible for other life in the universe based on the microscopic amount of knowledge we have in terms of science in relation to how much knowledge is left to be discovered is hard to believe for me. you must be the sort of person that needs to feel that he is right and you need others to believe that you are intelligent and right....sounds like you are a little insecure to me dude.

liz
12/30/2003 4:12:09 PM

Mr. Tago, Bill is right. You are assuming that any other species must necessarily be bound by the same scientific principles that we are; that is a truly blinkered outlook. We are finding things which confound those principles regularly - e.g. the life forms which live around the volcanic vents on the ocean bed - according to previously accepted scientific "wisdom", nothing should be able to survive there. But it does!
I know from your dogmatic posts that nothing anyone could say would persuade you to "believe", but please do not dismiss the experiences of these people so arrogantly. Have you ever considered that YOU may be wrong? Somehow I doubt it....

Don Tago
12/30/2003 5:15:36 PM

You all claim to be so open minded, yet you are listening to nothing i am saying. I didnt hear one comment on any of my arguements, while i take apart every single claim that you "UFO" believers make, you try and explain to me how i am wrong. A logical arguement goes like this, i take your claims and prove how they are wrong, and then you take my explainations, and explain how they are wrong, so on and so forth.

Also, you are ignoring the huge amount of coincidences that would have to happen in order for these creatures to find us. First, they would have to be within an area where our detection would be possible, the only way another civilization would know we were here would be for them to detect our radio waves, and we have only been transmitting them for about 60 years, so about a 60 light year radius. However, if they were to have gotten here by now, it is only really 30 lys, because once they recieved the signal, they would have to travel another 30lys at the speed of light just to get here. the civilization would have to have developed interplanetary travel, most likely at or near the speed of light. Then they would have to actually have the ambition and determination to want to come here.

So lets take the Roswell incident of 1947 to start. We all know the first broadcast that escaped into the depths of space was the Berlin Olympics of 1936. So, by 1947, the waves had traveled 11 lys. But for the aliens of Roswell to have actually gotten here, traveling at light speed RIGHT when they got our signal, they couldnt have been anymore than 5.5 lys away. And there is only one star system within that area. Proxima Centauri, at a distance of 4 lys. However, this is a triple star system, or in other words, three stars orbiting one another. And this fact would nearly make it impossible for any planets with intelligent life to evolve there. We only have a single star system, so it is relatively stable. But in a 3 star system, the orbits of planets would swing from very close to the stars and very far away from the stars, because of the variablility of the gravitational field. This would throw the temperatures on any planet from extremely HOT to extremely cold, which no life other than microbes and cyanobacteria could survive. Think about a planet that one day is as hot as mercury, and the next month as cold as the moon Europa. No technologically advance life could evolve there. But apparently, whatever intelligent life came to Roswell was incredibly stupid because they crashed right into our little planet, they should have tried the emergency brake!

Would any of you like to EXPLAIN that situation to me, where did i go wrong? I am more than willing to admit error. I know when to say i am wrong. But what i presented is a very logical and very well thought out arguement. It is not close minded and gives the aliens every benifit of the laws binding them.

I can admit, a lot can happen with a species over 500k years. If a species could survive that long, it would probably be very impressive and have a lot to offer us technologically. However, what people claim to see are not species that have been evolving for 100s of thousands of years. They are merely products of 40s and 50s pop culture of what we think aliens might look like, and that view hasnt changed much up to the present. And i refuse to admit an alien race that has traveled trillions of miles to get here, who have evolved more than our minds can fathom, who have developed technologies that make us look like cave men, would crash into the New Mexican desert. I would like to hear ANYONE say contrary!

Thank you!


liz
12/30/2003 6:33:25 PM

You say in your most recent post "I take your claims and prove how they are wrong." How can you PROVE these "claims" are wrong? The fact is, you can't. You're a lost cause, Mr. Tago. And people are going to argue with you forever on this subject. But the reality and the bottom line is this. The people who make these claims which you so arrogantly dismiss HAVE SEEN SOMETHING ANOMOLOUS. Have you? It does'nt matter how they got here. We don't understand how they did it either. But they did. And do. So unless and until you yourself actually see something of this nature, you will never be able to discuss it rationally - that is, to accept that there may actually be a lot of truth in the "claims", instead of simply rejecting everything we are saying.

Bill
12/30/2003 7:12:48 PM

***You all claim to be so open minded, yet you are listening to nothing i am saying. I didnt hear one comment on any of my arguements, while i take apart every single claim that you "UFO" believers make, you try and explain to me how i am wrong. A logical arguement goes like this, i take your claims and prove how they are wrong, and then you take my explainations, and explain how they are wrong, so on and so forth.

----ok, i'm going to do what you ask. i'm going to take what you say and respond to pretty much everything this time just for the hell of it. first of all, arguments aren't just about proving how someone else's argument or claim is wrong. i believe it also looks for common ground to build on to further one's point of view and accepts certain things to be a matter of opinion...a good argument is looking for truth and a person should be big enough to admit when he or she was wrong or revise their opinion before continuing the argument.

Also, you are ignoring the huge amount of coincidences that would have to happen in order for these creatures to find us. First, they would have to be within an area where our detection would be possible, the only way another civilization would know we were here would be for them to detect our radio waves, and we have only been transmitting them for about 60 years, so about a 60 light year radius.

----ok, here you state something as fact which clearly isn't. you say that the only way they could find us is by radio waves. how can you be so sure? that is the only way we can think of for the most part of finding intelligent life in our universe.....your applying our level of science and evolution to every other intelligent life form out there. Also, how do you know they don't have something to do with us to begin with? it is possible that they made us or helped our evolution along. i'm just saying it is possible. they could have happened on us by traveling in their space ships. They could have sent a probe out and that found us. They could have some other means which we are unaware of in finding us....They could have a thousand. my point is you sound like a blooming idiot when you state things so adamantly when they are clearly false, you can see that now right?

***However, if they were to have gotten here by now, it is only really 30 lys, because once they recieved the signal, they would have to travel another 30lys at the speed of light just to get here. the civilization would have to have developed interplanetary travel, most likely at or near the speed of light. Then they would have to actually have the ambition and determination to want to come here.

----ok, here we go again. you are assuming that the speed of light is the fastest that they can travel. Well, it was always thought that nothing could go faster than the speed of light.....according to einstein, etc. We have recently been able to send particles at up to 300 times the speed of light in some kind of test tubes. even if we hadn't it doesn't mean that other intelligent beings can't go faster than the speed of light. your logic is built upon false assumptions...Then you throw out a comment about how they would "actually have to have the ambition and determination to want to come here" ...are you now raising into question other life forms psychology? to use even in a small amount of your argument to suggest that other life may lack ambition and determination is just stupid.

***So lets take the Roswell incident of 1947 to start. We all know the first broadcast that escaped into the depths of space was the Berlin Olympics of 1936. So, by 1947, the waves had traveled 11 lys. But for the aliens of Roswell to have actually gotten here, traveling at light speed RIGHT when they got our signal, they couldnt have been anymore than 5.5 lys away. And there is only one star system within that area. Proxima Centauri, at a distance of 4 lys. However, this is a triple star system, or in other words, three stars orbiting one another. And this fact would nearly make it impossible for any planets with intelligent life to evolve there. We only have a single star system, so it is relatively stable. But in a 3 star system, the orbits of planets would swing from very close to the stars and very far away from the stars, because of the variablility of the gravitational field. This would throw the temperatures on any planet from extremely HOT to extremely cold, which no life other than microbes and cyanobacteria could survive.

----ok, about your triple star system and how life couldn't exist there because planets would at times come to close to one of the stars making it unhabitable. Yes i agree that makes sense. probably not life as we know it. but i wouldn't be surprised if some small life form was able to adapt depending on the conditions.

***Think about a planet that one day is as hot as mercury, and the next month as cold as the moon Europa. No technologically advance life could evolve there. But apparently, whatever intelligent life came to Roswell was incredibly stupid because they crashed right into our little planet, they should have tried the emergency brake!

---i myself wonder about how an alien civilization could crash on earth. you would think they are so advanced to be able to avoid such a thing, never mind it happening more than once. many possibilities do exist. accidents do happen....maybe, there are more than one race of beings out there and the least advanced of them made a mistake? maybe they did it on purpose? maybe it didn't happen. doesn't mean they don't exist.

****Would any of you like to EXPLAIN that situation to me, where did i go wrong? I am more than willing to admit error. I know when to say i am wrong. But what i presented is a very logical and very well thought out arguement. It is not close minded and gives the aliens every benifit of the laws binding them.

----laws binding them? lol. what laws binding them? the speed of light? i already answered that one. what other so called laws are you referring to? and what makes you think these laws cannot be manipulated?

***I can admit, a lot can happen with a species over 500k years. If a species could survive that long, it would probably be very impressive and have a lot to offer us technologically.

----gee, you think? they would be impressive to us and have alot to offer us technologically? really going out on a limb there huh?

****However, what people claim to see are not species that have been evolving for 100s of thousands of years. They are merely products of 40s and 50s pop culture of what we think aliens might look like, and that view hasnt changed much up to the present.

----you say that as if you know it. you don't know it, you assume it.

***And i refuse to admit an alien race that has traveled trillions of miles to get here, who have evolved more than our minds can fathom, who have developed technologies that make us look like cave men, would crash into the New Mexican desert. I would like to hear ANYONE say contrary!

---i already answered the part about crashing. but would like to address the part about how they may make us look like cavemen. your right certainly their technology would and probably their physical beings....but who knows.....maybe they aren't that much different than us.....maybe they are....maybe we are ant like to them? maybe we are naturally more intelligent than they are but they had more time to advance? who knows? i'd bet the government knows more than theyr'e sharing with us though. lastly, again, maybe they did or didn't crash here doesn't mean they are not here.

i saw them. up close. my immediate thought was it looked like something we would build. i'm not lying.

Allen
12/30/2003 10:46:22 PM

Don is misinformed. I suggest you read Colonel Phillip P. Corso's book 'THE DAY AFTER ROSWELL'. Also check out Dr Greer's disclosureproject.org website...you'll be amazed...and educated properly on the subject.


  Replies 1 - 10 (out of 44 total)



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